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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 20, 2013 23:30:32 GMT -6
Just kinda tossing the idea around for an engine swap on my 01 Rora. I like the 3.5, but I feel like the girl would benefit from a bigger motor.
So I was thinking maybe an LS-series swap? I have a very close friend who would help me with the install, I'm not too worried about that. It's more of the LS-series going from RWD to FWD. Is it possible? Anyone else have these wacky ideas?
I was also tossing around a 3800 swap. I come from the 3800 scene and I love those motors. From what I recall, the Intrigue was equipped with both the 3800 and the 3.5 shortstar. Does that imply possible swapability?
Thanks in advance guys
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Post by sall on Sept 21, 2013 11:28:47 GMT -6
Mate the L67 supercharged 3800 with the 4t80e(mods required) and go at it. Or just a heavily modded HD 4t65e(because I am assuming you want heavily mod the 3800). Why can't it be made to work? Remember sister car Riviera... just want to make her on steroids and in an Aurora. The aftermarket is uch greater. Would be a fun wallet sucking project.
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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 21, 2013 12:25:18 GMT -6
Mate the L67 supercharged 3800 with the 4t80e(mods required) and go at it. Or just a heavily modded HD 4t65e(because I am assuming you want heavily mod the 3800). Why can't it be made to work? Remember sister car Riviera... just want to make her on steroids and in an Aurora. The aftermarket is uch greater. Would be a fun wallet sucking project. Exactly! Thanks for the support! The Riviera and the Intrigue are the 2 models that make me think this is possible. Time consuming and expensive, but possible. The Intrigue had the 3800 and the 3.5 LX5 from the factory, so I could just go to a yard and take pics/study the engine bay and everything in the Intrigues there and get to planning. I have an old L67 from my Regal GS on a hoist in my garage. It's just been screaming to be brought back to life. Money sucking project ftw! It's like the best of both worlds! I get the comfort and styling of the Aurora, and the heart of my GS! Anyone have any other input? Any advice? Has anyone else thought of this/tried it? |
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Post by sall on Sept 21, 2013 12:45:11 GMT -6
Haha no problem! The idea has been tossed for dropping in the 3800 but most just go with a 4.6L who entertain the idea. No one has done a 4.6L drop in in the 2G though AFAIK. One is still stuck with no aftermarket with the 4.6L though too.
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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 21, 2013 13:12:00 GMT -6
Haha no problem! The idea has been tossed for dropping in the 3800 but most just go with a 4.6L who entertain the idea. No one has done a 4.6L drop in in the 2G though AFAIK. One is still stuck with no aftermarket with the 4.6L though too. Yeah, I was thinking the 4.6, but the lack of aftermarket kills me. That's why I was thinking LS swap, but I don't know how difficult that would be. I want the V8 power and sound. But if it's just cheaper and easier to go with the L67, so be it. I like the aftermarket anyway. I've been pricing it all out. So far, I'm about 85% set on it. I'll give Stage 6 a call and see how long they'd take/cost if I were to just send the car to them. I'll update with progress. How difficult would it be to mate the 4t80 trans onto the 3800 engine? Would it be better [and/or more reliable/stronger] to just go with the 4t65-hd? |
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Post by lkraft92 on Sept 21, 2013 14:54:11 GMT -6
If you want aftermarket parts for the northstars, check out Cadillac hot rod fab. They do a lot of northstar work.
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Post by sall on Sept 21, 2013 15:01:25 GMT -6
If you want aftermarket parts for the northstars, check out Cadillac hot rod fab. They do a lot of northstar work. Maybe you could make the cams work in our cars(with a tune and other stuff) but likely nothing else they sell. They've been talked about here before. It's mostly for people throwing northstars in other vehicles and sandrails. 3800 most defintely has the most aftermarket availability between the two. |
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bobsblue95
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Post by bobsblue95 on Sept 21, 2013 16:49:18 GMT -6
The hardest part will be the PCM. You'll literally need two computers, one for the engine and one for the chassis etc. You will have to somehow get both computers to think they are controlling the engine.
If you used a Riviera (or Intrigue) computer, you'd have to swap other modules to match it, like the instrument cluster.
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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 21, 2013 18:05:58 GMT -6
The hardest part will be the PCM. You'll literally need two computers, one for the engine and one for the chassis etc. You will have to somehow get both computers to think they are controlling the engine. If you used a Riviera (or Intrigue) computer, you'd have to swap other modules to match it, like the instrument cluster. I'm fairly certain the DIC wouldn't work with the new engine, and I'd be alright with that. But if I were to use an intrigue PCM, couldn't I splice my cluster into it? Or is it not that simple? |
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Post by lanceslambos on Sept 22, 2013 8:23:01 GMT -6
.... One is still stuck with no aftermarket with the 4.6L though too. There's quite a few aftermarket performance parts for the 4.6 |
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Post by sall on Sept 22, 2013 9:16:43 GMT -6
.... One is still stuck with no aftermarket with the 4.6L though too. There's quite a few aftermarket performance parts for the 4.6 Like what? Links and info please. |
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Post by ntrenn on Sept 22, 2013 9:56:59 GMT -6
Unlimited funds - it's up to you...
Working on a 4T65E out of a 06 Monte with a 5.3....pretty hot car when the tranny isn't burned up.
Since you already have a 3.5 - you're best swap is the 5.3 or the 3800 - stay away from the 4.6 and the 4T80 - unless you have extremely deep pockets.
I'm a little surprised that nobody has gone for the SC on the 3.5....
Good luck - you will need a LOT of time in the library and the boneyard getting all the parts together.
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Post by Marc on Sept 22, 2013 9:58:43 GMT -6
There's quite a few aftermarket performance parts for the 4.6 Like what? Links and info please. |
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Post by sall on Sept 22, 2013 18:57:15 GMT -6
Like I said... good luck getting any of the performance parts to fit under an Aurora hood. Yes it's for the N* but the products are for N*s in "Hot Rods, Sand Cars, Kit Cars & Fieros". The only things I seen are cams. Am I missing something. That site has been around for years it is nothing new to me.
Of course there is the head work but then you need others parts. We're talking bolt on parts here for the most part are we not?
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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 22, 2013 19:07:42 GMT -6
Unlimited funds - it's up to you... Working on a 4T65E out of a 06 Monte with a 5.3....pretty hot car when the tranny isn't burned up. Since you already have a 3.5 - you're best swap is the 5.3 or the 3800 - stay away from the 4.6 and the 4T80 - unless you have extremely deep pockets. I'm a little surprised that nobody has gone for the SC on the 3.5.... Good luck - you will need a LOT of time in the library and the boneyard getting all the parts together. Hm, that 5.3 doesn't sound like a bad idea. What's the aftermarket for those like? I get the feeling the 3800 swap would be easiest though. And I have a bit of a history with those motors. I've done a few swaps, so I'm not too scared of pulling motors and such. [7M-GE to 7M-GTE in my MKIII Supra, H22 to K20A in my buddie's Lude, 3100 to 3800 in my old Buick Century] The electronics have me a bit lost though. Would it be easier to just get the engine and tranny in, get everything hooked up as best I can, then flatbed the Rora over to a local shop that specializes in swaps? I need my Aurora for daily driving, so it's important all the electronics work. |
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RCA1186
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Post by RCA1186 on Sept 23, 2013 6:07:20 GMT -6
The hardest part will be the PCM. You'll literally need two computers, one for the engine and one for the chassis etc. You will have to somehow get both computers to think they are controlling the engine. If you used a Riviera (or Intrigue) computer, you'd have to swap other modules to match it, like the instrument cluster. This is where I get skeptical, I think, physically the motor would get in there fine etc, it would just be rough getting it to work computer wise. |
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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 24, 2013 0:26:07 GMT -6
I'll pull a wiring harness or 2 from the Intrigues at my local JY. Along with PCM's and ECU's. Also, this: www.youtube.com/watch?v=2C3nX01N1YkSo this is my announcement that the 3800 swap IS happening. I will keep everyone updated. All of my other projects are on hold so I can focus on this swap. |
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Post by sall on Sept 24, 2013 6:14:11 GMT -6
Sweet! Haha he was a bit excited! Do the electronics work though? That is the question!
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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 24, 2013 16:16:35 GMT -6
Sweet! Haha he was a bit excited! Do the electronics work though? That is the question! I get the feeling I can just pull a harness from a 3800 Intrigue at a yard and pull up wiring diagrams and spend a night wiring. I'm very good with electronics, so I'm not too terribly worried about it. I'll be getting the ZZP tuned PCM for the 3800 too, so that should mitigate some issues [or it may exacerbate them, who knows?] |
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Post by sall on Sept 24, 2013 16:27:23 GMT -6
Well, if you need any help with wiring/pinouts let me know! I have access to it all FSM wise. I'm good in that area too electronics wise.  Please document this process [very]well. I might not skip over the v6 2G Auroras anymore when I come across them lol. |
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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 24, 2013 18:07:42 GMT -6
Well, if you need any help with wiring/pinouts let me know! I have access to it all FSM wise. I'm good in that area too electronics wise. Please document this process [very]well. I might not skip over the v6 2G Auroras anymore when I come across them lol. If you had access to the 2G 3.5 and the Intrigue 3.5 and 3800 pin outs, I would be eternally grateful. I plan on documenting this process extensively, as I'm aware that [especially around here] one can't make claims about a project and not deliver. I won't disappoint you guys. |
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XJSman89
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Post by XJSman89 on Sept 25, 2013 7:48:38 GMT -6
Randy will be calling you out faster than white on rice if you don't show pictures. ;D He keeps us all honest around here. ;D
Sounds great, man! I'm excited for you. I'll be good to actually see someone do a swap on a 2G. If it has ever been done it can't be more than a couple times, No one has ever done a swap to a different motor for the 2G on ACNA as far as I know.
I agree with the 3800 selection. It has a better chance of communicating effectively and will probably fit better... the 5.3 would be a mess with all the limited space in the Aurora, especially for an LS motor. It would require a lot more modification to make it work properly.
We threw a 5.3 in my boss's 98 Cherokee at work and it took some doing. The wiring took a lot longer than the actual swap. I made a few brackets to relocate the accessories and such and it all looks nice and clean in there but I never had to worry about space, there is so much of it under that hood that I could put stuff wherever I wanted to. I hope that doesn't end up being a problem for you! How much do you like body work? Could you make a modified hood for the Olds if you had to?
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RCA1186
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Post by RCA1186 on Sept 25, 2013 11:22:57 GMT -6
You had better build that thing up too, I want a FAST Aurora haha
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Post by Kersh on Sept 26, 2013 5:57:00 GMT -6
Not that it matters, but I think the 5.3L has smaller outer dimensions than the Northstar/Aurora motors (at least from the perspective of the valve cover height and total width).
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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 26, 2013 7:50:55 GMT -6
Randy will be calling you out faster than white on rice if you don't show pictures. ;D He keeps us all honest around here. ;D Sounds great, man! I'm excited for you. I'll be good to actually see someone do a swap on a 2G. If it has ever been done it can't be more than a couple times, No one has ever done a swap to a different motor for the 2G on ACNA as far as I know. I agree with the 3800 selection. It has a better chance of communicating effectively and will probably fit better... the 5.3 would be a mess with all the limited space in the Aurora, especially for an LS motor. It would require a lot more modification to make it work properly. We threw a 5.3 in my boss's 98 Cherokee at work and it took some doing. The wiring took a lot longer than the actual swap. I made a few brackets to relocate the accessories and such and it all looks nice and clean in there but I never had to worry about space, there is so much of it under that hood that I could put stuff wherever I wanted to. I hope that doesn't end up being a problem for you! How much do you like body work? Could you make a modified hood for the Olds if you had to? Thanks! I appreciate the support. It seems like around here most people are supportive, as opposed to other forums where everyone wants to bring up the fact that the 3800 is older, it will be difficult [-gasp!- You mean, I actually have to use my brain and do -heavy breathing- WORK?!] I get the feeling I might "clean up" the engine bay while I've got the motor out. I will probably move the PS, AC, coolant bottle, and fuses/relays, and do a good wire tuck. Gotta make it look clean and nice, ya know! Poppin hoods at car meets and what not. I agree on the fit and communication part. I will probably be able to get the car running and everything just fine. It's the other electrical things that I will need to work out all the kinks. I'm actually very good at body work. I deleted the rear fogs on my 01's bumper cover [the right way! Not just filling with bondo] and I like the look a whole lot better. I don't think I'd need to modify the hood for the 3800 however. I feel like it will be a good fit. I could lower the mounts if I absolutely needed to. But I don't think I will. Besides, I'm putting the car on air, and I'm going to want that clearance on the bottom. [blowing up oil pans ftw] You had better build that thing up too, I want a FAST Aurora haha Oh trust me, I'll build it up! It will be a slow, steady build, but it's getting BUILT. I miss my Regal enough that I want to do things I never got to on that car. [-cough- Twincharge? -cough-] |
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Post by michiganaurora on Sept 26, 2013 10:53:39 GMT -6
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RCA1186
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Post by RCA1186 on Sept 26, 2013 11:29:20 GMT -6
[-gasp!- You mean, I actually have to use my brain and do -heavy breathing- WORK?!] You had better build that thing up too, I want a FAST Aurora haha Oh trust me, I'll build it up! It will be a slow, steady build, but it's getting BUILT. I miss my Regal enough that I want to do things I never got to on that car. [-cough- Twincharge? -cough-] I like the way you think lol....probably because you are a fellow metalhead |
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Post by Kersh on Sept 26, 2013 12:16:05 GMT -6
There really should be little fabrication needed. The '01-'03 Bonneville SSEI's were supercharged 3800's and have the same chassis/underhood configuration as the '01-'03 Aurora.
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Post by redheadmetalhead on Sept 26, 2013 22:33:48 GMT -6
There really should be little fabrication needed. The '01-'03 Bonneville SSEI's were supercharged 3800's and have the same chassis/underhood configuration as the '01-'03 Aurora. Really? Iiiiiiiinteresting. So would I be better off looking at a Bonne instead of and Intrugue? I'm going the L67 route (gotta get those groceries FAST) I'll look into that. Thanks for the info! |
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Post by Kersh on Sept 27, 2013 7:24:02 GMT -6
Getting parts from a Bonneville would work much better for you.
The "W" body cars (Grand Prix, Intrigue, Regal) use a different mount configuration for the motor than the "A" body cars (Aurora, Bonneville, Park Avenue) when using the 3800.
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Please document this process [very]well. I might not skip over the v6 2G Auroras anymore when I come across them lol.
