scottydl
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There's nothin' like an American V-8...
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Post by scottydl on Sept 30, 2004 13:21:24 GMT -6
Who's got 'em? I know an intake will only accomplish a certain amount, without also modifying exhaust... but I'm still interested in the advantages (practically and asthetically) of an aftermarket setup, before I decide whether or not to drop the $50-60 on a drop-in K&N filter for my stock airbox. Of course images are more than welcome.  |
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Post by SupaStealth on Sept 30, 2004 15:40:09 GMT -6
well, i'm sure you've seen mine  40 bux off of ebay, it'd be nice if i had a k&n filter on there though, maybe some other time. |
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Post by erw38 on Sept 30, 2004 19:33:25 GMT -6
40 bux off of ebay, it'd be nice if i had a k&n filter on there though, maybe some other time. will a k&n filter fit on there? have you tried? what's stopping you? |
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Post by SupaStealth on Sept 30, 2004 20:17:41 GMT -6
i'm sure they make a k&n cone filter for that size, 3" is a common size. The money is the main thing, i'm going to wait til i make a shroud and then i'll probably end up putting a k&n on there.
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Post by erw38 on Sept 30, 2004 21:48:50 GMT -6
gotcha
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Post by kobalt on Oct 1, 2004 0:32:18 GMT -6
I like the intake idea. K&N is the way to go, some knock offs have been known to have inferior filtration/durability - some even disintegrate and get sucked into the motor. Im not saying you should panick, but consider getting that K&N ASAP.
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scottydl
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There's nothin' like an American V-8...
Posts: 7,373
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Post by scottydl on Oct 1, 2004 7:58:29 GMT -6
That's what is keeping me from the ebay intakes... I'm afraid they are TOO cheap and will suffer greatly in quality. Have you had any specific problems with yours, Supa? Does the air getting sucked in stay cool enough?
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Post by SupaStealth on Oct 1, 2004 9:26:28 GMT -6
I haven't had any problems with anything getting sucked in the engine that isn't supposed to be. The air coming in isn't as cool as i'd like it to be, but when i make my fiberglass heat shield it'll cut down the heat, cause at running temp, the aluminum pipe gets to probably around 120 degrees F. The argument has been made that the cfm has a greater effect than temperature. i'm going to try and lower my intake temp with that heat shield while hopeflly maintaining the flow, and when i get the k&n cone filter in there, it will be nice, hopefully i'll be able to make another quarter mile run to see if it helped or not.
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Post by JimW on Oct 1, 2004 11:21:41 GMT -6
Remember 32V require MORE air, the density of the air (temp) is less of a factor then the volume of air that is required to feed the 32V's However to benefit, an exhaust mod is recommended to achieve best results. btw My RSM intake is sitting in my trunk with no filter yet  |
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Post by Aurora40 on Oct 1, 2004 16:14:00 GMT -6
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Post by JimW on Oct 1, 2004 19:24:28 GMT -6
Right, we did talk about this. Now before we get to scientific about it, the boys at RSM simply stated that the volume of air required outweighed the need for it to be cold. Any box added will greatly reduce any air movement inside the engine bay, therefore nullifying the benefits of the intake itself.
So, the total difference in air temperature with a box added, will not help your performance as opposed to not having a box....because the volume of air required is more important then slightly cooler air, regardless of the amount of oxygen present in a cubic square of air.
Now that I reread this its baffling, but anyway, add a box if you wish to count o2 molecules frankly I will take the increased air flow and live the fact that I live in a nation that doesnt have to deal with 100+ F temps all year around.
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Post by Aurora40 on Oct 3, 2004 8:36:49 GMT -6
Well, the volume of air taken in to each cylinder is always .5L. How much mass of air is in that volume depends on the pressure and temperature of that air. It is the most mass of oxygen that is needed to burn the most gas to make the most power.
I bet even in Canada, it is well over 100F under your hood. :-P I've put a remote temperature sensor in my airbox once. The air intake temps through the stock one were not a whole lot higher than ambient temp. I imagine this would change with a cone filter.
It sounds like your premise is really that you think the less restrictive filter increases the pressure in the cylinder, thus adding more mass of air. The pressure in them is somewhere slightly less than atmospheric pressure. So I guess it depends on how much less. If it were 20% less, then I suppose it's possible to have a 15% increase in pressure. I think what you are saying is that a filter that flows more air through it will allow the intake manifold and such to be at less of a vacuum. But I think cam timing and valve size/lift has much more to do with how well-filled the cylinders get than the air filter does.
The temperature of air is much easier to change and to know the effect. If you lower the temperature of the incoming air by 50 degrees, perhaps by waiting until winter vs summer, with the car breathing exactly the same, it will absolutely get more mass of air into the cylinders on each intake stroke. And you can know almost exactly how much more air it will be getting.
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Post by kobalt on Oct 3, 2004 21:11:47 GMT -6
Aurora40, did you measure the air temperature inside your airbox with reflectix on versus off?
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Post by Aurora40 on Oct 3, 2004 21:36:19 GMT -6
Nope, I've never done that. I used our outdoor thermometer, and I had to take the airbox apart. I guess also I don't care all that much. The reflectix is on there, so whatever it helps, it helps, measured or not. It weighs ounces, so there's no real downside. |
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Post by kobalt on Oct 3, 2004 23:01:57 GMT -6
Aurora40, where did you pick up the reflectix? I would be interested in making a comparison myself. Whatever the difference, Im sure it is there.
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scottydl
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There's nothin' like an American V-8...
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Post by scottydl on Oct 4, 2004 9:04:37 GMT -6
Okay, here's an auction of the typical ebay intake that is currently listed. I don't want to buy an aftermarket kit with a junk filter, but these folks (ebay seller "intake_power") have something to say about their blue cone that is included: Any thoughts or truth to this? I have no problem with a generic product, as long as quality doesn't suffer substantially. |
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Post by SupaStealth on Oct 4, 2004 9:37:25 GMT -6
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Post by Aurora40 on Oct 4, 2004 10:43:41 GMT -6
Aurora40, where did you pick up the reflectix? I would be interested in making a comparison myself. Whatever the difference, Im sure it is there. I picked it up at Home Depot. They also sold the Reflectix tape to tape it up. I got a huge roll, like 4'x24' maybe, for about $25. I have enough to wrap the thing at least 10 more times... But I'm sure it will fall apart a bit over time. I posted a thing about when I did it. It's around here somewhere. |
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scottydl
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There's nothin' like an American V-8...
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Post by scottydl on Oct 4, 2004 10:45:16 GMT -6
Yeah I found those too, but there is a considerable difference in price. I'll save $$ where I can...  |
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Post by Letitroll98 on Oct 4, 2004 12:24:40 GMT -6
Scotty, a regular K&N square filter for the stock air box goes for around $50-55. This whole unit goes for $25. How good do you really think it will be? (BTW, + $15 S&H, I love it, you have to pay them to pick it off the shelf and mail it ground UPS, who picks up at their door. They spend all of $2 shipping this to you, what jerks!)
A poor air filter will pour dust and dirt into your ENGINE. Why would you consider this? Of course you wouldn't, you just need someone to validate what you already know. This is no deal!
Supastealth's example looks much better, a real K&N unit for a very reasonable price, except they want $18 S&H! What, is it $2 harder to pick the K&N off the shelf? These people amaze me with what they think people will swallow. However, simply tell them you'll arrange for your mailing agent to pick it up at their door. Call UPS or FedEx and have them drop by with a prepaid shipping label. I'll bet ya money marbles or chaulk that the seller refuses this. S&H is where their profit is. Jerks.
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scottydl
Super Moderator
There's nothin' like an American V-8...
Posts: 7,373
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Post by scottydl on Oct 4, 2004 12:38:51 GMT -6
A poor air filter will pour dust and dirt into your ENGINE. Why would you consider this? Of course you wouldn't, you just need someone to validate what you already know. This is no deal! Hehe, perhaps this is indeed the case. And believe me, I *always* factor in shipping costs when buying on ebay. Often times a buyer can work out a cheaper shipping option with the seller, if you contact them before the auction ends (I've done this several times). |
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1badaurora
Aurora Watcher
Do you hear that Mister Anderson? That, is the sound of inevitability.
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Post by 1badaurora on Oct 15, 2004 18:57:39 GMT -6
I was wondering: might it be possible, for those of us that have original air-box, to possibly install a round/cone K&N filter on the inlet of the lid of the air-box...so technically all you do is remove the panel filter inside, and somehow put a round/cone K&N with inlet diameter the same as the diameter of the inlet on the lid of the air-box, therefore the airbox itself works as a heatshield. That or remove the air-box, and use the original intake tube and just put a round/cone filter on the end of the factory intake tube....? is any of this possible, or did I just make an ass out of myself...(I am not really mechanically inclided, just a brain fart I had)  |
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dred98
Aurora Driver
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Post by dred98 on Oct 15, 2004 22:48:55 GMT -6
You'd probably do better just getting the proper flat K&N and putting it in the air cleaner box. After modding the box first of course |
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1badaurora
Aurora Watcher
Do you hear that Mister Anderson? That, is the sound of inevitability.
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Post by 1badaurora on Oct 15, 2004 22:57:39 GMT -6
My box was already gutted, the only thing left to do is make the hole larger on the bottom half of the air-box...I removed the resonator and sealed off the inlet.
But do you think the above mentioned idea(s) might be workable?
Im leaning more towards removing the top/bottom portions and just rigging up a cone filter to the factory intake tube.
Im just wondering, is the expense of a K&N filter going to deliver "noticable" results?
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dred98
Aurora Driver
Posts: 470
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Post by dred98 on Oct 15, 2004 23:02:31 GMT -6
I really don't know if a cone filter is more efficient than the regular flat filter. Without the air box the temperature would be higher too - there's some debate about how important that is though. I haven't bought a K&N myself yet - I'm still saving up.  |
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1badaurora
Aurora Watcher
Do you hear that Mister Anderson? That, is the sound of inevitability.
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Post by 1badaurora on Oct 15, 2004 23:08:39 GMT -6
Come to think of it, a cone filter would not fit "inside" the air box, as I had thought it might...unless you only keep the top part of the air box, to work as a heat shield, and remove the lower half???
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1badaurora
Aurora Watcher
Do you hear that Mister Anderson? That, is the sound of inevitability.
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Post by 1badaurora on Oct 26, 2004 11:26:36 GMT -6
Any thought?
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scottydl
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There's nothin' like an American V-8...
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Post by scottydl on Oct 27, 2004 12:24:17 GMT -6
From looking at the stock airbox, I'm not sure there would be any good way to keep the upper half in place without its attachment to the lower half. You'd probably have to drill into it and rig up some kind of mounting brackets, and at that point you may just be better off making a custom heat shield out of plexiglass or something. Of course that is all speculation, since I've never tried either option! |
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Post by stevensolds on Oct 28, 2004 15:03:52 GMT -6
Lets just say i am sticking with my new paper Purolater filter i just bought from Pep boys. Works just as good when clean.
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