I Feel Like Such A Good Boy

[Marc]

I drove through a seat blet checkpoint today. The PD in
my town sets this up quite frequently, and at the same
location all the time. You would think that everyone in
this place would know about this by now, but they don't.
I am always amazed at how many people are ticketed
for not using seat belts.
Naturally, I was using my seat belt. The coppers looked
at me so approvingly, and waved me through. A lot of
other folks weren't using their seat belts, and were written up. This made me feel like such a good boy!!!

______________

GM!!! BRING BACK OLDS!!!

[JimW]

Is seatbelt wearing still a problem in the US?

I remember watching documentaries about HUGE ad campaigns in the 80's about Americans and the lack of seatbelt usage.

We dont seem to have those problems here in Canada. It suprised me to see (esp on the Interstates) how many people dont wear em.

Who else wears or doesnt wear? And for what reason?

[dred98]

JimW said:

Who else wears or doesnt wear? And for what reason?

I buckle up automatically now, I don't even think about it.
I can't imagine why people wouldn't wear the seat belt.

[Aurora40]

JimW said:

Is seatbelt wearing still a problem in the US?

What's more of a problem is enforcement/creation of trivial traffic laws for profit. How is it the state's place to decide that have to wear a seatbelt?

I always buckle up no matter what, but resent the fact that I have to prove it to anyone. And I doubt that anyone who doesn't care about wearing one will suddenly start because it's against the law. If you are dumb enough to think you won't get caught in a collision with no belt on, you are probably dumb enough to think you won't get caught by the police without one on.

[omegaic]

Seatbelts save lives. It's up to us (law enforcement) to make sure that darwin's theory of evolution doesn't apply to humans. That's why you get a $40.00 ticket in NJ for not wearing your seatbelt.

[erw38]

Just $40.00. I think it's closer to the century mark down in my neck of the woods.

[SupaStealth]

i always wear mine, just cause i guess, and anyone riding in my car has to wear them, just because if somehow we get into in accedent, i'm not responsible for their death or serious injury.

[Aurora40]

omegaic said:

Seatbelts save lives. It's up to us (law enforcement) to make sure that darwin's theory of evolution doesn't apply to humans. That's why you get a $40.00 ticket in NJ for not wearing your seatbelt.

Actually, as it turns out, freedom is not about saving lives. It's about being free. Seatbelts do save lives, which is why I make a conscious choice to wear one. However, if some adult feels the extra comfort or extra of "cool" is worth putting his life at risk, who are you or I to tell him otherwise? He's not putting other people in danger by not wearing it. Walking out the door to go to work, or going downtown to see a movie puts your life at risk. Some risks are small enough vs the payoff to take, while some are not. But where do you draw that line? It probably depends on who you are. How is it in the state's authority to draw that line for people?

Also, how much of New Jersey's budget for seatbelt checks actually comes from the federal government and not the state?

[SupaStealth]

when people are in my car they aren't free, i own them, so thats why they have to wear a seatbelt, lol, jk

[omegaic]

Strangely enough, "seatbelt checks" fund themselves. ;D

[scottydl]

I agree with everyone here, for the most part... I always buckle up, and I can't imagine the lack of intelligence that would keep someone from doing it. (I feel the same way about motorcycle helmets, but that's an issue for another thread. )

Jim, seatbelt non-usage is still a big problem in the US... and the issue had been re-ignited lately because many states are now making it a "primary offense" meaning you can be pulled over and ticketed JUST for no seatbelt. Before this year (in Illinois) it was a "secondary offense", meaning you had to be stopped for some other violation first. Then if you were still dumb enough to leave the belt off when Officer Friendly approached, you could get a ticket for it.

Aurora40 said:

How is it in the state's authority to draw that line for people?

Because "The People" get the state involved, by lobbying for laws such as these. I'm sure it's not easy to be a parent that received that midnight call, only to learn that their child was killed in a wreck for simple lack of seatbelt use. Or how about the police officer or paramedic that has to go search some field to find the broken, lifeless body of someone ejected from a rolled vehicle? It might be part of the job, but it's still no fun. It might be the victim's own fault for not buckling up in the first place, but it was still completely avoidable. If a small fine will make someone think twice about NOT buckling up, then I'm all for it.

Yes, there is a line that should be constantly guarded when it comes to government involvement in people's personal lives & decisions, but in this case I think the benefits of the law far outweigh the costs.

My 2 cents...

[Amanda]

MA has a 25.oo fine for not wearing a seatbelt...

[SupaStealth]

well, i've had two friends get killed in car accidents, and they didn't wear seat belts, one got thrown out the window, the other one was just so bad that even if he had worn a seat belt he still would've been killed. i guess they're a big reason for me wearing a seatbelt other than the secure feeling

[Letitroll98]

omegaic said:

Seatbelts save lives. It's up to us (law enforcement) to make sure that darwin's theory of evolution doesn't apply to humans. That's why you get a $40.00 ticket in NJ for not wearing your seatbelt.

Listen, I were my seatbelt all the time. I’ve been in mildly serious accidents twice in the last 40 years and they’ve saved me from at least some kind of injury. My grown boys won’t ride in or drive a car without wearing them, so I preach what I practice.

But I respectfully have to take issue with the attitude expressed by our fellow member omegaic. The police’s job is not to hassle citizens about every little aspect of driving a car in NJ, it’s to keep the peace and protect the general welfare. There’s nothing about enforcing some stupid seat belt law that was pushed through the legislature by the insurance lobby that has to do with the peace and welfare of the general populace. And since you can’t write a cell phone or seat belt violation unless it’s coincident with another violation, I’ll continue doing what I please in these matters.

I’d also go on about how I’ll continue using my radar detector until I see patrolmen obeying the speed limit on normal patrol, but that would be taking unfair advantage of your honesty in admitting your professional service, however humble it may be. (Just kidding, just kidding!!)

But seriously, police seem to be taking this all too far. If there’s an accident or moving violation caused by cell phone use, write ‘em up. If someone’s speeding and not wearing a belt, book ‘em Dano. But stop pulling over people and threatening them with another violation just so they can write up a cell phone or seat belt violation. (Yes, happened this week to one of my employees in New Jersey!)

[omegaic]

Hey, don't cut me a raw deal here. Police are just enforcing laws that elected officials make. Majority says everyone should wear their seatbelts or get a ticket then that's what we do.

[scottydl]

Letitroll98 said:

And since you can’t write a cell phone or seat belt violation unless it’s coincident with another violation, I’ll continue doing what I please in these matters.

This is incorrect (unless you are only speaking of NJ), as these types of violations are "primary offenses" in many places. See my post above.

In Illinois, seat belt tickets are non-moving violations... insurance companies generally never find out, cannot raise premiums, and therefore have no benefit in such a law. On second thought, they probably do pay fewer death claims when people are saved by seatbelts, so I guess that would be a benefit (and I can't say I disagree with that).

R4D30N said:

a month or so ago, i was sitting ... so FOUR copcars pull up. (no exageration) and search my car ...

I think you left out a key point... I'll bet my Aurora that you either consented to the search, or the police officers had probable cause that something illegal was inside. If your car was searched otherwise, you need to notify the Chief of Police and file a civil lawsuit.

R4D30N said:

...so after this, i say to the pig, blah blah blah

(1) If you deliver a disrepectful or ***** remark, then don't be surprised if that's what you get back.

(2) You WERE that officer's responsibility at that point, so it seems senseless to suggest that he should be doing something else (much of which is a Detective's job anyway). See (1).

[Aurora40]

omegaic said:

Majority says everyone should wear their seatbelts or get a ticket then that's what we do.

That's not exactly true. Was the seatbelt law put to a referendum? Do you think the majority support red-light cameras? I'm not trying to pin the blame on you for enforcing the laws, though I'd guess you have some discretion in it. But it's an ongoing thing of enacting laws/enforcement of rather small things in order to generate revenue for the state or fed, or to just increase govermental control over behavior (there are folks who are for that without the profit incentive).

Edit: Also, one key thing about the United States vs a simple democracy is that the US is a free country first and foremost. Being a democracy does not ensure any freedoms at all, it only ensures the majority can push around the minority. This is why the US has notions like inherent rights, the Constitution, etc. It's not a perfect system, but the more people embrace the ideas of freedom and responsibility and self-reliance that started it all, the more perfect it can be.

[dred98]

Aurora40 said:

Edit: Also, one key thing about the United States vs every other democracy is that the US is a free country first and foremost.

I take exception to your claim that the US is the only free democracy - if you want to include only the last 50 years or so, within living memory for many of us, then a lot of other countries are more free or as free as the US.
Please keep the thread on the subject of seat belts without bringing in the rest of the world.

[Aurora40]

dred98 said:

I take exception to your claim that the US is the only free democracy - if you want to include only the last 50 years or so, within living memory for many of us, then a lot of other countries are more free or as free as the US.
Please keep the thread on the subject of seat belts without bringing in the rest of the world.

Hardly the cornerstone of my point, and I don't care to debate it. I assure you I couldn't care less about other countries' governments when it comes to US seatbelt laws. I've edited my original post.

[Aurora40]

R4D30N said:

well, i guess we were just sitting there, breaking laws and all. that's why i hate pigs, they think they're so high up and great, when they know they aren't anything out of their uniform. quite honestly, if cops weren't so gay about small things, i might respect them.

When you speak like that, it hardly makes your respect something anyone would care to aspire to earn. Police officers are just people like you and I. Some of them are jerks, some are arrogant, and most are helpful, friendly, and professional.

[JimW]

Please be aware that we may have law enforcement as board members. "Hating pigs" is a pretty insulting term.

[omegaic]

Hey, the other great thing about the USA is freedom of speech, right? In Russia you go to GULAG!

On a lighter note, watch this: www.sniperbait.net/videos/vids/Cops-train.wmv

[scottydl]

Awesome! ;D ;D ;D ...for the watcher, not the officer that is. I bet he wished the TV crew hadn't been with him that day. He just might have violated the Des Moines PD's vehicle pursuit policy on that one.

And to keep things on topic, you'll notice he WAS wearing his seatbelt!

[erw38]

I wonder what he changed the evaluation to say?


Don't cops know that you should never stop your car on railroad tracks.

[Letitroll98]

Right on point Aurora40. We are not a Democracy, which the founding fathers equated to mob rule, we are a Republic. One of the flaws of the system is its inherent tendency toward bureaucracy lending career politicians a platform for favoritism and graft. Thus things like seatbelt laws.

And thanks omegaic for so graciously noting our free speech rights. Most effectively employed when used with a respect for others, R4D30N. Believe me, I'm not at all happy with police enforcement of traffic laws and non enforcement of serious crimes in South Jersey. However no one gets your point when your post gets deleted.

omegaic, you do have the right to show discretionary privilege. Serve and protect, we need you. And yes scottydl, it is a secondary offence in NJ. So sorry its not in your state.