|
|
Post by norbi on Feb 16, 2006 18:06:57 GMT -6
Hi
I have a 2002 Aurora with 80k miles on and i was wondering if its possible to put a 4.6 Northstar in it. I am wondering becasue the engines are almost the same and i also heard the wiring is the same also so would it work. I think that the DIC might show the wrong fuel economy and probably the main computer has to come with the 4.6 but if its same wiring to me looks like it will work or am i missing something here. And did anybody ever do this before i any auroras?
|
|
|
|
Post by macadamiaman on Feb 16, 2006 18:19:21 GMT -6
It seems like every other person here proposes this in one way or the other as if it's nothing. And they're all so serious.
There are a lot of interworkings and complexities that'd give you trouble that you seem aware about - go for it if you want to, but in the end people always wonder, is it really worth the extra 25 or so horsepower?
|
|
|
|
Post by norbi on Feb 16, 2006 18:33:53 GMT -6
I am curious because i have my 88 Cutlass Supreme and when my 2.8 engine died i had a 3.1 from a 93 put it and its only 10extra HP and 20lb of torque and was worth it. And had no choice had to replace engine so i did it with newer one. I was saying that if something happens with my 4.0 engine if its possible to do it and what are the differences between them and 50hp is worth if i have to change engines.
|
|
|
|
Post by Marc on Feb 16, 2006 18:55:15 GMT -6
And did anybody ever do this before i any auroras? So far as I know, no one here or anywhere else has ever done this. |
|
|
|
Post by GlennS87 on Feb 16, 2006 18:59:17 GMT -6
You would need custom programming. The PCM has to be told about increased displacement, injectors, etc...
|
|
|
|
Post by norbi on Feb 16, 2006 19:47:07 GMT -6
But if PCM was changed from 4.0 PCM to 4.6 PCM would be easier to just change it from one to another since (most likely ) wiring is same on both engines.
|
|
|
|
Post by Custom88 on Feb 16, 2006 22:09:31 GMT -6
The computers are the same too, other than programming.. you also have the same transmission. The ENGINE BAYS on the 2nd gen are even the same as the Cadillacs.. I don't think this swap would be too hard, as long as the wiring is the same... it'd be worth a shot I'd guess. people put northstar engines in cars like Fieros, I can't imagine a car with the same chassis as a cadillac, and already has a n* engine woudl be THAT difficult to do..
|
|
|
|
Post by norbi on Feb 16, 2006 22:36:27 GMT -6
Thats what i think but is there to verify that wiring is same, i heard from a lot of ppl that its the same but i never verified it and what would give a problem when swapping and if PCM is same and trans i would think rest it too.
|
|
|
|
Post by 95mushroom on Feb 17, 2006 2:20:45 GMT -6
Try it, buy a salvaged 00-03 STS and give it a go. If not, part out the STS and make a profit.  |
|
|
|
Post by Marc on Feb 17, 2006 9:19:35 GMT -6
I know that the Aurora & Northstar engines are the same external size. The trans is the same, so there would be no problem there. But I have heard about wiring differences.
Actually, I am surprised that in the 11 years that the Aurora has been around, that nobody tried this swap.
|
|
|
|
Post by GlennS87 on Feb 17, 2006 9:46:07 GMT -6
The computers are the same too, other than programming.. you also have the same transmission. The ENGINE BAYS on the 2nd gen are even the same as the Cadillacs.. I don't think this swap would be too hard, as long as the wiring is the same... it'd be worth a shot I'd guess. people put northstar engines in cars like Fieros, I can't imagine a car with the same chassis as a cadillac, and already has a n* engine woudl be THAT difficult to do.. Typically people who put Northstar's in anything other than a caddy run an aftermarket ECU such as FAST, Accell DFI, Electromotive etc.. As far as using the 4.6 pcm, their might be issues having to due with the cars other systems such as gauges, climate control, stabiltrack etc.. I'm not quite sure what PCM controls on these cars but I know it more than just the engine. Other elements that need to be considered with custom programming would be such things as torque converter lockup, gear ratioand probably some other things I'm forgetting to mention. I believe this swap to be much more complicated than most think, but I never tried it so what do I know. |
|
|
|
Post by norbi on Feb 17, 2006 10:02:17 GMT -6
Thank You guys and i am also surptised that in such a long time nobody ever done this. But doesnt ABS and Stability have own computers i would think that the DIC wouldnt work properly but i am not an expert but thanks a lot guys and i tell that to my mechanic that was curious also about this.
|
|
|
|
Post by flintoid on Mar 2, 2006 22:30:53 GMT -6
For all the ink I've seen spilled on this, what is the difference like 50HP? With a Corsa and K&N filter you're just over halfway there and you still have the rest of your weekend.
|
|
|
|
Post by Marc on Mar 3, 2006 12:41:47 GMT -6
If I wanted my 2001 to run faster, the first thing that I'd do would be to lighten it. I've heard that all the soundproofing insulation adds a lot of weight.
|
|
|
|
Post by macadamiaman on Mar 3, 2006 12:56:31 GMT -6
hehe.. those people that take out the soundproofing to go faster are a little rediculous. Why not just buy a Honda Civic? It's all been done for you!
|
|
|
|
Post by Marc on Mar 3, 2006 13:01:13 GMT -6
hehe.. those people that take out the soundproofing to go faster are a little rediculous. Why not just buy a Honda Civic? It's all been done for you! NO!!! |
|
|
|
Post by Wacko on Mar 3, 2006 13:32:02 GMT -6
But doesnt ABS and Stability have own computers i would think that the DIC wouldnt work properly I believe the computers for each subsystem are different physical components tied together with a serial data bus. Whether these systems require all in place in order to perform correctly, I don't know. |
|
|
|
Post by 2001v8244 on Mar 28, 2006 23:31:26 GMT -6
I'm going to do the swap as soon as I'm finished paying
for mine...
Its an 01. I did some research and compared the PCM pinouts between the 2001 STS and the 01 4.0 Aurora and every pinout is exactly the same. And, knowing the way that GM does things I'll bet that the 02 and 03 pinouts are the same as well. I'm sure that you would even have the ability to run the N* on the 4.0 computer. After all, the wiring harness, and ignition controls are the same You might get lean codes or fuel trim codes *But* it would run. Or, the PCM may be able to compensate for the six tenths of a liter extra displacement. Since the pinouts are the same, the only problems that I can see coming are axle ratio calibration, 3.31 or 3.71:1 and fine tuning of the fuel trim values.
Perfect fuel trim values would be as simple as swapping in a computer from an STS. The STS computer would also give you the correct speedometer calibration and the STS's cool Performance Algorithm Shifting feature that utilizes sensor inputs that you already have since you ordered a V8 engine with the standard stabilitrak system.
Axle ratios differ between the HP biased premium V8's(SevilleSTS|Deville DTS 300HP N*, and the Aurora 4.0 250HP) because they use the 3.71:1 axle ratio compared to the 3.31:1 ratio used in the midrange torque biased 275 HP N*.
(SLS 275HP|Deville, DHS)
Systems such as climate control, security, traction/stability, and other body functions would not be affected because they have nothing to do with, or they use the same GM corporate signals between modules.
|
|
|
|
Post by Marc on Mar 29, 2006 8:56:44 GMT -6
When you do this, let us know how it works out.
|
|
|
|
Post by norbi on Mar 29, 2006 22:12:12 GMT -6
finally somebody that did some research and is planning to do something similar i want to do same thing in future but i never knew anybody that knew so much or did a research but i think if one will do it more people will try doing it and issues will be worked out for other ppl in future.
Thank you
|
|
|
|
Post by norbi on Mar 30, 2006 9:54:20 GMT -6
one more thing if you take the engine with trans from STS and PCM its just plug and play then right?
|
|
