bobsblue95
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Scars of pleasure, scars of pain. Atmospheric changes make you sensitive again.
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Post by bobsblue95 on Sept 23, 2012 14:31:09 GMT -6
That's a creative solution Lance1. Should work assuming that A)your problem is the terminals inside the ignition tumbler and B) you use your second key to turn the tumbler/ignition switch to start the car. You need to take precautions against the terminals shorting to the key itself obviously. Good luck and keep us posted!
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Post by lance1 on Sept 23, 2012 17:46:05 GMT -6
Well that worked like a charm! As you suggested bobsblue95 I lined the key with electrical tape and cut out the section with the contacts. Took the car for a drive and started it a dozen times. Unheard of before. Why did I wait so long to do this...
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Post by sall on Nov 24, 2012 18:35:56 GMT -6
What gauge is the OEM wiring? Looks small like around 20? 20 gauge is what I used. Well, 20 on a JST connector I had laying around. Being I just want to see if I can get this car started trying the RFID is not really a viable option. I can disconnect this easily once I store this car.
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Post by sall on Nov 25, 2012 16:36:44 GMT -6
It worked perfectly. I have plenty of JST connectors and resistors to match every key resistance. PM me if anyone ever needs one pre-made
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RCA1186
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Rob
Go Pack Go!
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Post by RCA1186 on Nov 25, 2012 16:42:34 GMT -6
Like it, nice and clean, and a good security measure when you're not using the car
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mjwalcott
Aurora Driver
Half the fun of modding a car...is fixing the bull that needed to be fixed first
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Post by mjwalcott on Jun 2, 2013 21:06:47 GMT -6
how does the jst connector work???
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Post by sall on Jun 3, 2013 5:58:42 GMT -6
how does the jst connector work??? It works the same way as any other bypass. Except the resistor portion is easily removable via the JST connector for immobilization.
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mjwalcott
Aurora Driver
Half the fun of modding a car...is fixing the bull that needed to be fixed first
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Post by mjwalcott on Jun 3, 2013 9:00:16 GMT -6
how would this work with the rfid tag? i saw the post and did some further research and it seems like a cool security feature
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Post by sall on Jun 3, 2013 9:29:58 GMT -6
how would this work with the rfid tag? i saw the post and did some further research and it seems like a cool security feature Very easily though you wouldn't need a removable JST as the relay and RFID reader does the switching for you. No need to disconnect resistor string for security. You use an RFID reader to trigger a SPDT relay which 'activates' the resistor string on the VATS wires. The resistor string is only active when the RFID reader has received the correct card or fob.
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mjwalcott
Aurora Driver
Half the fun of modding a car...is fixing the bull that needed to be fixed first
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Post by mjwalcott on Jun 4, 2013 20:23:45 GMT -6
so heres another question, has anybody wired a switch or something as added security? im afraid to wire something to the bypass and it ends up putting my car in the permanent "clean key wait 3 minutes"
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Post by sall on Jun 4, 2013 20:39:25 GMT -6
You are over thinking it. That will not happen unless you install the wrong resistor value.
You are having intermittent issues with your key. You install bypass with correct resistor value. System always sees correct resistance.
To install the bypass you cut the VATS wires. The VATS wires at the cylinder are no longer connected because the wires are cut. Therefore even when inserting the key that was giving you trouble the resistance will never be read from the key only from the bypass.
Just put a simple toggle switch(if you want) and resistor string between the VATS wires and call it a day.
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XJSman89
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Post by XJSman89 on Jun 4, 2013 20:43:14 GMT -6
It's as easy as adding resistors between the wire. I did it tonight in 15 minutes. I'm going to wire in a kill switch in addition to making the resistors removable, that should be enough security for me haha
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Post by sall on Jun 4, 2013 20:45:39 GMT -6
Yes. Very.
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mjwalcott
Aurora Driver
Half the fun of modding a car...is fixing the bull that needed to be fixed first
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Post by mjwalcott on Jun 4, 2013 20:45:40 GMT -6
im torn between the simplicity of the kill switch which would disable the resistors or a rfid module for the security and the cool facotr
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Post by sall on Jun 4, 2013 20:47:07 GMT -6
Either way if someone wants to steal your car bad enough, they will.
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mjwalcott
Aurora Driver
Half the fun of modding a car...is fixing the bull that needed to be fixed first
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Post by mjwalcott on Jun 4, 2013 20:56:31 GMT -6
yeah, this discussion is only ways to make grand theft aurora difficult
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XJSman89
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Post by XJSman89 on Jun 4, 2013 20:59:56 GMT -6
RFID would be nice, it sure has the cool factor. Automatically disables the bypass whenever you walk away. The problem with that is the remote start, it would have to be on a separate bypass. Mine is supposed to be done separately but I couldn't start the car with remote start at all before I wired in the bypass, interesting. Don't know what the issue is there. I'll test it and see what the deal is, maybe start a new thread if needed.
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mjwalcott
Aurora Driver
Half the fun of modding a car...is fixing the bull that needed to be fixed first
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Post by mjwalcott on Jun 4, 2013 21:07:48 GMT -6
how would i wire a switch if i were to go that route. like i said i would want to be able to disable the resistor string on demand.
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Post by sall on Jun 4, 2013 21:18:13 GMT -6
You cut the VATS wires and insert the switch and resistor like this: Good luck! It's simple, you can do it.
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Post by sall on Jun 5, 2013 13:29:20 GMT -6
In another thread about push button remote start I linked a RFID kit from dx.com. They have been sold out since that time. Bobsblue linked a different RFID module from rfidadvance.com. I purchased the TR1 kit(sans relay, I have hundreds of them). I hasn;t opened the package to play with it until this monring since the recent talk of mjwalcott's interest in the RFID option. Just as I suspected this diagram I posted a few posts up works perfectly! Now a consideration to make is that the RFID only outputs 12v to the relay when the RFID tag is present. Meaning the RFID module is momentary not constant. As soon as you pull the RFID tag away it shuts off the 12v output to the relay. So, if you were to carry the RFID fob tag on your key chain and it goes out of range(125KHz very short range) while driving your security light illuminate and who knows what else(no time to look in FSM now). The solution to this is to use a momentary to constant relay setup. One swipe of the RFID tag and the resistor relay 'switch' will stay active until you turn the car off and back on with next swipe of the rfid tag. I am contemplating installing in my '98 now, but in no hurry!
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bobsblue95
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Scars of pleasure, scars of pain. Atmospheric changes make you sensitive again.
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Post by bobsblue95 on Jun 5, 2013 14:20:31 GMT -6
Hey Sall, Can't you use a bluetooth connection in your carputer to detect when your cell phone is present for the same effect?
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Post by sall on Jun 5, 2013 14:31:04 GMT -6
Hey Sall, Can't you use a bluetooth connection in your carputer to detect when your cell phone is present for the same effect? Most likely. I have that setup for auto detect for hands-free calling. I'm sure it's doable, but the '98 doesn't have a CarPC and the '96 security system doesn't have bypass at this point everything works the way it should. So, I'm not messing with the '96 haha.
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Post by sall on Jun 6, 2013 18:40:16 GMT -6
Latched RFID VATS Bypass - One Swipe of RFID Tag I will breadboard this circuit and try it in my '98.
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bobsblue95
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Scars of pleasure, scars of pain. Atmospheric changes make you sensitive again.
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Post by bobsblue95 on Jun 7, 2013 9:57:10 GMT -6
Don't forget a way to UNlatch it! Use ignition power, not RAP. RAP could leave your car vulnerable for up to 10 minutes. Also, your top diode is backwards, would prevent the sensor signal from reaching the second relay.
Myself, I would not even use RFID to replace VATS, as VATS is only protection against starting the car, and is too easy to bypass. If I put RFID in my car, it would rely on me being in the car to even continue running properly. I'd probably put the sensor down by the pedals and the fob in my shoe. Then, if the tag disappears, there would be a timer before disconnecting something important from the PCM, like coolant sensors or transmission solenoids. Nobody's going very far with only second gear in limp mode.
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Post by sall on Jun 7, 2013 11:06:20 GMT -6
Don't forget a way to UNlatch it! Use ignition power, not RAP. RAP could leave your car vulnerable for up to 10 minutes. Also, your top diode is backwards, would prevent the sensor signal from reaching the second relay. Myself, I would not even use RFID to replace VATS, as VATS is only protection against starting the car, and is too easy to bypass. If I put RFID in my car, it would rely on me being in the car to even continue running properly. I'd probably put the sensor down by the pedals and the fob in my shoe. Then, if the tag disappears, there would be a timer before disconnecting something important from the PCM, like coolant sensors or transmission solenoids. Nobody's going very far with only second gear in limp mode. The top diode is to keep the relay 1 latched. It is correct. I have breadboarded it. The other two diodes are just flyback diodes for protection. The RFID out triggers the latching relay only. 12v acc triggers the coil on resistor string relay, but only when relay 1 is latched. Yes, RAP will stay on for ten minutes if a door isn't opened AFAIK. I have to open a door to get out of the car. No vulnerability there. Door opens relay unlatches resistor string is now 'open'. I wouldn't want the car to stop if I wanted to leave it running and walk away. This no less safe than traditional bypass or a toggle switch. It is pretty much the same as 2G transponder. I will try it out in the car and let ya know how it works! I'm going to etch the relay board some time this weekend. EDIT: Loked in FSM quickly... RAP operation confrimed.
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bobsblue95
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Scars of pleasure, scars of pain. Atmospheric changes make you sensitive again.
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Post by bobsblue95 on Jun 7, 2013 14:44:39 GMT -6
Don't forget a way to UNlatch it! Use ignition power, not RAP. RAP could leave your car vulnerable for up to 10 minutes. Also, your top diode is backwards, would prevent the sensor signal from reaching the second relay. Myself, I would not even use RFID to replace VATS, as VATS is only protection against starting the car, and is too easy to bypass. If I put RFID in my car, it would rely on me being in the car to even continue running properly. I'd probably put the sensor down by the pedals and the fob in my shoe. Then, if the tag disappears, there would be a timer before disconnecting something important from the PCM, like coolant sensors or transmission solenoids. Nobody's going very far with only second gear in limp mode. The top diode is to keep the relay 1 latched. It is correct. I have breadboarded it. The other two diodes are just flyback diodes for protection. The RFID out triggers the latching relay only. 12v acc triggers the coil on resistor string relay, but only when relay 1 is latched. My mistake. In that case, you're also feeding 12v back to the output of the device. I'd suggest another iso diode. Better yet, just move that one to the input line. You don't really need it where it is. Ah, different mindset since mine's modified, stays on until I lock the door with the door open. I can shut the door and lock it with the remote to keep RAP on. It's illegal (and a bad idea) to leave a car running unattended in Texas. My system would protect me in the event of a carjacking. You never know. Takes less than 30 seconds for a thief to get into a locked car. Less than 3 if they're desperate for crack. Cool beans!
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Post by sall on Jun 7, 2013 20:33:26 GMT -6
Yes, I left the diode out on the trigger wire. Fixed it below. There is endlessways to set it up that is for sure. This is still safer than tradition bypass(with a switch or not). Here was my final circuit: Also, proof of concept video with etched PCB. Resistor string not active until single RFID swipe. Then you can see resistance measured on DMM.
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mjwalcott
Aurora Driver
Half the fun of modding a car...is fixing the bull that needed to be fixed first
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Post by mjwalcott on Jun 7, 2013 23:27:28 GMT -6
bypass works like a charm now i gotta do some more wiring and ill be good to go.
so heres some questions, what could possibly screw up the signal? how close does the rfid tag have to work? and last would this work without remote start?
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mjwalcott
Aurora Driver
Half the fun of modding a car...is fixing the bull that needed to be fixed first
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Post by mjwalcott on Jun 7, 2013 23:42:11 GMT -6
one more think I think the rfid would better for door locks. I know this is the vats post but rfid would be good to unlock the doors. But as far as vats goes its up to personal preference, it just matters what you want. I like bobsblue idea but if it were to disconnect a sensor or whatever, what residual affects would that have. btw sall how would you program rfid towork for the doors. Make a new post if necessary please.
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Post by sall on Jun 8, 2013 8:03:00 GMT -6
bypass works like a charm now i gotta do some more wiring and ill be good to go. so heres some questions, what could possibly screw up the signal? how close does the rfid tag have to work? and last would this work without remote start? What could screw up the RFID signal? Nothing if you the latched relay setup. Without the latching setup if the rfid tag goes out of range the security light will illuminate while driving. The RFID tag has range of about 3 inches. It's short. That's the point. Just like a transponder key the reader is around the ignition. Yes, it works without a remote start. one more think I think the rfid would better for door locks. I know this is the vats post but rfid would be good to unlock the doors. But as far as vats goes its up to personal preference, it just matters what you want. I like bobsblue idea but if it were to disconnect a sensor or whatever, what residual affects would that have. btw sall how would you program rfid towork for the doors. Make a new post if necessary please. Why would it be better for unlocking doors? Realize a standard VATS bypass or bypass with switch leaves your car more vulnerable than this!! This is inherently the same as a 2G transponder setup. I'm curious to know why one would think a resistor string and switch is better than using RFID? Sure you can make more complicated and make it when the RFID tag goes out of range it kills injector pulse or something or put trans in limp mode. This is all something that the security does NOT do from factory and for a very obvious reason. It's dangerous. I'm not saying RFID is the safest method either... Just fun little project. Hooking RFID to module to unlock doors... simple. RFID out to door actuator solenoid.
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